Episode Summary

In this Prime Talk Podcast Sponsored by GETIDA – Ian Sells – Founder of MDS – talks about the growth opportunities of selling on Amazon, also more information about his life’s journey. #IanSells #MDS

About Ian Sells founder of MDS – 

Initially called the 50k+ group, Million Dollar Sellers (MDS) quickly evolved into a powerhouse community. Gaining traction with more and more successful 7-figure sellers, it became known as the only group with vetted, full-time, and proven Amazon sellers striving to forge their way on a rapidly growing marketplace that offered no roadmap or guidance.

From the very start, Give More, Get More, has defined our ethos. We require our members to have a highly active engagement to stay in our community. In addition, we’ve always had a strict policy of no info-marketers and no gurus.

Find the Full Episode Below

Yoni Mazor 0:00
Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of prime talk today I’m excited to have a unique, interesting, special guest. It’s Ian sales. Yin is many things. So check this out. He’s the founder of the million-dollar sellers, also known as MBS is a founder of elite sellers. He’s also the founder of rebate key, he is still an Amazon seller. And he’s still a seller after he made an exit selling in his Amazon business to try sale. So we’re going to touch more on that during the episode, so stay tuned. Ian, welcome to the show.

Ian Sells 0:34
Hey, Yoni. Thanks for having me. It’s great to be here.

Yoni Mazor 0:36
My pleasure. I was waiting for this episode for a long time. So I’m excited. And thank you for your time. Because this episode, today is going to be the story of you the story of in sales, you’re going to share with us everything. Who are you? Where are you from? Where did you go up? How did you begin your professional career, station to station until we hit where you are today, in the world of E-commerce. So without further ado, let’s jump right into it. Yeah,

Ian Sells 0:58
Thank you. Yeah, I can kind of start off by just saying, you know, I got started unconventionally. I was a real estate broker in California, I’ve been selling houses since 2004. Kind of got started right out of college.

Yoni Mazor 1:12
This bullet is fast. So let’s just sit back. So let’s start with the early beginning. Where were you born?

Ian Sells 1:19
Born in Los Angeles, Cedar Sinai. La sounds born or raised la moved to the Bay Area for high school. And then northern right of California, San Francisco, right, that’s Bay Area, you know, Silicon Valley area kind of thing. Then I was there for about four years and then went to college at San Diego State. And that’s where I kind of I still reside in San Diego and moved to Texas for a couple of years doing commercial real estate. But really,

Yoni Mazor 1:45
As you’re growing up, I just want to set the environment you’re growing up because it’s very clear that you’re a super entrepreneur and also very successful at it, I want to go back and kind of touch the elements. So growing up in California, La Barre, San Diego, fine. But as you were growing up your parents, for example, what kind of industries were they involved in?

Ian Sells 2:02
My father was in user design and music. My mom was in PR, so worked for a couple of big corporations, and, you know, really just kind of learned from them, like, how to be diligent and put your head down and work. I can remember though, like, I was always entrepreneurial from the beginning, you know, doing going to garage sales and finding things and buying and then taking them for free or $1, and then refurbishing them and selling them, or like selling five toys and go buy one new one right?

Yoni Mazor 2:35
On the streets, or this is ready. Yeah, you know, just

Ian Sells 2:37
just Yeah, on the streets, you know, have your garage sale, you go figure out how to flip things you understood before eBay, things like that. And

Yoni Mazor 2:45
What you do with the money just by yourself toys, you know, you know, like, as a kid, you just kind of

Ian Sells 2:49
Come up with a way like I was just able to, like, always have the new toy or whatever I wanted. Because I would get rid of a couple of toys and sell them off. And then I’d have extra cash on top of the cash I’d already had or you know, earning from allowance or whatever it was, you know, and so I was always able to, like, figure out how to, like, get the things I wanted quickly and, and do that I can remember like, one of the things that I think changed for me was I like every Sunday, I would read the Sunday newspaper, I was just thinking about this other day. And I would look at the ads that I wouldn’t care about you know, the news, that wasn’t my thing.

Ian Sells 3:19
It was like, I was so young, I would just look at the section where that all the ads, all the products. Now we’re in the target that we’re in, you know, Kmart, I think there was, you know, all these different stores back then circuit, city, whatever it was. And I would just kind of like to look at the prices of things. And I was just really interested in commerce, actually from an early age. And I think that’s good back to how I kind of understand the marketplace, I can kind of understand what things costs. You know, I know what toothpaste costs, and what some people will never know, I already knew because I saw it in ads, you know, I knew what, you know, a nail file or like, whatever, you know, these things that you know, most people don’t think about. So I can remember being interested in commerce. But early on.

Yoni Mazor 3:56
It’s an interesting question. It’s interesting because you got the sensitivity for the price points. But I think also between you caught up to the marketing approach. Yeah, all these big brands and billions of dollars throughout the year’s investment there was a new absorb that from a young age, in addition to all that, I’m sure it’s some of their products. If you had you know, an interest in them, you want to get it, you want to be able to generate extra cash to go get it. I think it’s a unique early combination, which is off the beaten path. And I never heard of that kind of approach before. So I finally

Ian Sells 4:24
Yeah, very becoming very aware of like marketing and what works and what caught my attention and like what’s a good deal? Like how do you know, if you see something for sale? How do you know it’s a good deal? Just because I’m failed? That doesn’t make it a good deal, right? That could be marketing.

Yoni Mazor 4:37
Today. I’m in my 30s I wasn’t like that was growing up. So yeah. So I

Ian Sells 4:41
Think I from an early age, I always had that I had my first job. You know, when I was 15 scrubbing floors of the deli, worked the nose bagels, you know, rode my bike, I didn’t have to work. You know, fortunately, my family had enough money to like, you know, provide a good life for us. But like I always just wanted to work, have my own money, have my freedom, you know?

Ian Sells 4:59
Got my car as soon as I could, I went and bought it by myself, my parents couldn’t even go with me, I went there with my money and bought my first $5,000 car, you know, and that leaves me up, you know, through college and stuff like that. So, just really, like, always pushing forward on the envelope and always just trying to take action quickly. And just not being scared of, you know, what could happen. I have like, a no fear type of mentality, you know, it’s like, I always tell me, like, what’s the worst going to happen? You fail. So what you started again, like, it’s not a big deal if you fail, right? So, but you witnessed a lot of people, who put roadblocks in front of them. And they

Yoni Mazor 5:36
Give you a, mentally for the most part, like, they

Ian Sells 5:39
Give you all the reasons why they can’t do something, well, I want to start a business, but you know, I have a full time. So, you know, do it when you go to sleep, you know, stay up later, you know, like, I do the same thing. But when it comes to the gym, but that’s my roadblock, you know, because I’m like, Oh, I got to work. And I got all these things to do. It’s like no, like, is a gem, and yeah, but like, I just couldn’t 40 so I’m like, I’m making a mental commitment. Like I have to block out that time I have taken care of myself for my family. But yeah, so back to this.

Yoni Mazor 6:06
Yeah. So now what I wanted to touch into the Sunday environment growing up, I want to touch the college years. Educational, so you went to you got your education in San Diego, you said

Ian Sells 6:14
Yes. Can you go to State University?

Yoni Mazor 6:16
Look over there, we’re just studying,

Ian Sells 6:18
I went, and I got admitted as a computer science major. And realized in the first semester that I was not going to be a programmer, and I was more of a business person. And I saw I joined the finance department had a real estate major, and I was getting interested in you know, other stuff. And, and I always said, like, if I’m going to sell something, I used to sell out Circuit City, I would sell computers and stuff.

Ian Sells 6:39
And so the mantra was like you’re going to sell something or sell something expensive, right? So you can make bigger commissions. So you know, real estate, real estate. So I did that. And I ended up getting into that program. And I also joined a fraternity, a social fraternity or, you know, Sigma Pi if anybody’s out there.

Ian Sells 6:57
But, you know, I was interested in real estate. So I took that course. And it was like, all you know, by the time you graduated, you didn’t have to work in the industry for two years, you can get your broker’s license right after you graduate. But for me, that wasn’t good enough. I wanted to get my license and start working beforehand. So I took night school I went to night classes at Century 21 and got my real estate license before I even graduate, even though I could have waited. So I thought I always just had like, you know, push the envelope, right. And I remember my first real estate job was it was in the mortgage business. And as I was just doing cold calling.

Yoni Mazor 7:33
I want to sample you on this right now. So this is when you’re breaking into the professional world, right? So you got your real estate license with 10 century 21 as the hub. So what year was that when he started working?

Ian Sells 7:42
Well, I mean, I worked through college to work through college. But this is where I started to, like really feel like, okay, this is what I want to do. And so and I could, you know, I always wanted to make money. So that was like always a driving force. It wasn’t like I cared about working, I was like, I just want money and resources and be able to buy things I want trips I want. So you know, while in school, I didn’t have to work, I got a job at a mortgage company. And I was just doing cold calling, you know, and this is like, two years before I graduated. And

Yoni Mazor 8:13
It was that when he was entering that company doing cold calling. I was still

Ian Sells 8:17
In college. So it was you know, it was like I was 20 or something like that. Right? 21. And I was just working for I was just making smile and dial and you know, it

Yoni Mazor 8:26
Was that like on the calendar, I was just wanting to sound like the

Ian Sells 8:30
2000 to 2000 to 2000.

Yoni Mazor 8:35
Selling why are you selling mortgages,

Ian Sells 8:36
I was at that time, you know, there was you’d have these teams that would call for mortgages. And then you’d have a loan officer that would do the closings, and then they go out there and find the deal. So I got in this business, it was just like they give you these papers, these lists of you know, addresses phone numbers and the bank name. And you call them and say, Hey, can I see a loan with Bank of America work with Bank of America? And we can lower your mortgage, you’d say about $5 less? Is that something you’d be interested in? Right? And that’s literally like the start of the script?

Ian Sells 9:02
And of course, you’d say yeah, I’d be interested that oh, you work with being American cool, like great. But what I found was after working there for three, three weeks, I was like I was making 2530 bucks an hour, which was great, you know, but the guy I was working for was three years older than me. And he showed me his check. He made $100,000 in that month off deals that I was giving him and one month in one month, so I’m not a million dollars here. Yeah. $100,000 Closing Yes, he’s a million dollars.

Ian Sells 9:29
Exactly. So you know, to me that was like okay, Bibles went off and that’s why I went and got my real estate license because to be a loan officer, you need a license. So at that time, you didn’t need a mortgage license you just need a real estate license so that’s why I was expelled and I was like a company my license so did that he wouldn’t promote me so I went to another company and I can remember they said this is a funny story is like it was literally like the boiler room right you go in there everybody standing around you these guys of all meathead and he just like he’s like sink or swim do get on the calls and like I’m just dealing you know, like my face. The call was like, you know, got picked up to do my speech. He’s like, yeah, that sounds great. When can you come out and I was like, sweet, so like, boom got like my first loan, like right there on the spot with like everybody looking around, you know, saying around me, you know, and I was like Oh cool. So then, you know, went out there and signed

Yoni Mazor 10:14
The yoga area, by the way, is Austin ego local COMMBUYS you go to San Diego, and you go ahead and sign up.

Ian Sells 10:19
Well, you get the loan app, and then you’re going to go out there and you get all this document you guys were covering national regional law it was local, local San Diego stuff. So they got it. So that’s just kind of like the sales business kind of go and then I started buying houses I made over $100,000 before I graduated, I bought my first house before I graduated. And then we started doing college rentals in the San Jose area and I buy a house affordable house, I’d add on two bedrooms, turned into a six-bedroom house rented out for like $5,000 a month and then I refinance take all my cash back out basically

Yoni Mazor 10:50
What year did you graduate those up started doing you know, started 2004 2004 Yeah, it doesn’t for us. But that time we already have two or three years of business, you know, behind you, you got you to know, you’re doing cold calling, but you also you know, you’re a loan officer, right? Yeah, loan officer. Yep. So you’re making 100 grand, but what else you already had you flipping real estate and renting out already at that point in 2004.

Ian Sells 11:14
Yeah, I bought my house before I graduated. So 2004 bought my first house right there, like a block no blocks from campus, you know?

Yoni Mazor 11:21
So these two years were super, hyper-aggressive for you, right? You take it easy graduate and go to that track. By the time you got there. You’re ready. You’re ready, like, you know, the 10 to 15 years into the industry into the mix in terms of speed. So that’s kind of lightning speed. That’s impressive. Okay. 2004 You graduated, you have a house, you’re making, for lack of a better word making bank. What was the next move? Yeah. So

Ian Sells 11:40
I ended up partnering up with a couple of guys from my fraternity. One guy from my fraternity and one guy that worked with me, at the mortgage company, and within three years, we bought 100 houses in the neighborhood. We rented them out to college kids, we sold some of them, and we flipped them. We were driving prices high. We were built building College, mini college houses, you know, and renting them out, we put plasma TVs and hot tubs and all the houses. It was the early days, right? This would be for granite countertops, or even a thing and

Yoni Mazor 12:11
Like we work live environment for college students back into you know, yeah.

Ian Sells 12:17
So, you know, then my buddy had an idea to get a limo. So we had our limo drivers. We had our construction workers have drivers are night so we picked up college girls from the houses and take them to the bars. And you know, we had a great time. And then, you know, things started to change. The markets are changing as a, you know, things were changing the market. We had a run-in with the city attorney, he was trying to like people are opposing what we were doing because we’re redeveloping neighborhoods,

Yoni Mazor 12:44
Gentrified it. Yeah.

Ian Sells 12:46
Well, you know, in real estate, it’s called highest and best use, the highest and best use of the house that’s walking into the campus is not for a senior citizen to retire in. It’s for college housing. And that’s really what we were doing and the prices were going up. But people still hated what we were doing cuz they don’t want to live next to college kids because like, you live next to the college. And the college has grown right.

Ian Sells 13:04
So we started doing this in other neighborhoods. And there’s because of our all of our students wanted to move to the beach and live next to the bars and stuff. So we started building 678 bedroom houses in the beach area, you know, taking these million our homes turning into one and a half million our homes and stuff like that. And people just started going up in arms about it. It was kind of like

Yoni Mazor 13:23
Our buddies from college. Yeah, and the fraternity,

Ian Sells 13:26
One from the fraternity and one I worked with in college. So yeah, I started talking fast. But, you know, we turned this into a business and we had, you know, over 100 houses under management, we had a property management company. And we ended up just, you know, moving on to we moved into commercial real estate, so we moved out to Texas and started buying, raising caps and capital.

Yoni Mazor 13:48
Is that when you made that Texas, Texas move that was like 2008 Nine. So that’s the global financial meltdown.

Ian Sells 13:55
Yeah. Yeah, it reminds me, sorry, it was probably 2009 we moved out there in 2010 11. But

Yoni Mazor 14:02
The crisis like affected your business now triggered the move to Texas. You said okay, evolution is

Ian Sells 14:07
Now the financing for residential is starting to change. So we’re like, Okay, we’re gonna go to commercial, right.

Yoni Mazor 14:13
What would you do with it before you cast it out, you

Ian Sells 14:15
Know, kept captive. It was a cash cow, right? Everything was renting. You know, the college rentals. If you ever look into it, it’s a great market to be a part of. But yeah, so we moved into commercial real estate. So that’s how I got my chops in buying apartment buildings for the same price as the house in San Diego. I was buying a 500-unit or sorry, a 50-unit apartment building in Texas. So you’re buying 15

Yoni Mazor 14:37
Austin area or

Ian Sells 14:38
No, we didn’t well, we bought in Dallas. We bought in Amarillo, we won Houston we bought you know kind of all over. And you know, we said hey, if we can manage college kids, we can manage apartment buildings, you know, and tenants and so you know, like I said, for 500 hours already you buy houses you do or you can buy a fifth unit or building in Texas. So hey, let’s get some more doors. There was a much more challenging operation than we expected. And then the market changed and there was no liquidity in the market, you couldn’t sell these properties, you couldn’t refinance them. So we had some hard money loans. So we had to really like reorganize and raise more capital, we had to like give out, give our properties back to the shareholders to help make them whole. And eventually, they all got out of those things. And we got out of that, too. But it was a great learning lesson of how the market impact can impact you. And so I wanted to start another business. If I did that, well,

Yoni Mazor 15:29
Let me get this straight and started coaching that so. So it seemed like a cycle, you were in the boom cycle, right? It was on the upside. And then there was we’re turning down and there’s, you know, the markets are dry, especially on the financing side. And crypto is, you know, inability to grow and maintain. So you look at liquidating the Texas portfolio or the entire real estate portfolio across the board.

Ian Sells 15:47
Just Texas, just Texas. Yeah, the thing that bothered college rentals is college was always in session. The rents can’t come in, the property values did drop, but the rents still came in just fine. So

Yoni Mazor 15:57
That’s good. As long as that’s, you’re working with the government directly. So that’s good. Okay, so what? So what did you make the more the next move is and what year did you liquidate Texas, and what do you move? Yeah, so

Ian Sells 16:07
I moved back to San Diego from Texas. And, you know, started my own real estate company. I was at my property management kind of split up with my partners, and we all split ways at that time. And we kind of just, everybody’s got to kind of do their own thing. So I had a real estate company, a property management company, I was flipping houses and doing renovations and making money that way doing short sales where I was helping people like, you know, get out of foreclosure and things like that.

Ian Sells 16:35
And I started investing in some other businesses, I had cash and I was trying to figure out what the next move is. And we’re getting tired of doing real estate. Now we have been in this business for almost 10 years, right, and kind of like what’s the next move I don’t want to go show houses all the time was a lot of work. started investing in a buddy from college, another good friend, did his first cash advance, bought some product in China, and has been out there a couple of times and started selling on Amazon and this has been in 2012 2013. So really early on, and he was able to all of us, like give him $5,000 All his friends and like we’d all do joint ventures on products

Yoni Mazor 17:11
That he found out about e-commerce slash Amazon, as far as you know, I believe

Ian Sells 17:15
He was just like, he was one of those guys that had a million ideas. And none of them were successful until this one was, you know, and so it’s funny to hear from you guys get a lot of disguises like, you know, just always pushing the envelope and just kind of being scrappy and resourceful. Not everybody

Yoni Mazor 17:33
Doesn’t 1213 your buddy is pretty much the one that brought the e-Commerce slash Amazon knocking on your door. And yeah, he

Ian Sells 17:41
you know, I was already interested, I was trying to do affiliate marketing, I was trying to do all this other stuff, you know, trying to get out of the real estate business or, or find another way to have cash and other you know, income stream, right. And, and so you know, what I was working on and you know, didn’t work. But this, I invested with him and it worked out. And then my first ship and our second shipment got seized by the government. Because we were importing at this time. We didn’t know but we were importing counterfeit products. We didn’t know they were counterfeit, you know, wow, this is early days. You didn’t you’re like, oh, I’m buying you know, original OEM, you know, I think it was I was selling Xbox hard drives. He was selling sign Heiser and Bluetooth speakers, you know, and headsets like yours, right? Are high-end. But he didn’t know that they were fake. Until government because

Yoni Mazor 18:25
You’re reselling it. It wasn’t like a private label movie. It was like, it wasn’t a private label at the time. Yeah, that was a name brand. But it was actually on the counterfeiters,

Ian Sells 18:34
Because this is before you knew like Alibaba and the manufacturers just tell you that they’re legit, you know? Oh, yeah. Cool. So you made your first book and you’re like, oh, yeah, yeah. So So then he’s like, Hey, I’m going to China. Do you want to come with me? I’m like, Yeah, let’s go. So we went and stayed at a hostel, you know, went to the Canton Fair, you know, until you

Yoni Mazor 18:53
When you first hit China slash Canton Fair. Was that

Ian Sells 18:58
Like 2013 or 2014?

Yoni Mazor 19:00
You’re already kind of tuned to the mix of the game. Yeah, we had already

Ian Sells 19:03
We had already I had already had a taste of E-commerce. And before that, I always, you know, because my comeback kind of your science, my real estate company kind of took off because I was good at marketing. And so I was doing I was able to get my website ranked likes to host for sale like number one or two, meaning this other guy was competing for that. And then I was I figured out Craigslist, I was able to do 1000 posts a day on Craigslist in the real estate section driving traffic to my website.

Ian Sells 19:30
So I was generating 20 3040 leads a day on my website, and I was selling them to agents and kind of making money that way. So kind of that your science like really played a role in life where I wanted to be and I always wanted to have a web, a software company and try to build a lot of them. I owned a company called I tried to build College Area rentals. Do I own that domain name in the early days, right because I’d always college rentals but never got it off the ground? But anyway, so you know, learn Amazon understood that this is a great business model it

Yoni Mazor 20:00
Makes money in China right Canton Fair. Was this a kind of an eye-opener? Or what was it? What happened there?

Ian Sells 20:03
Oh, I mean, I was already aware of, you know, this model. And it was just like, we were just going there to find new products to sell. These were our early days. And

Yoni Mazor 20:11
We were was resolved to pivot into your private label brand.

Ian Sells 20:15
Yeah. So that was kind of the how, you know, we realize you can’t sell Microsoft hard drives, they don’t allow you that,

Yoni Mazor 20:21
Right. I gotcha. I got it. So that pushed you to make the move into private label, which, looking back probably was the best decision and that’s definitely

Ian Sells 20:29
Definitely yeah, this is why we started selling Bluetooth speakers, solar chargers, and, and power banks when anchor started, so the anchor was like, we were looking at anchor like, oh, there is competition. That’s how early was because we would go to the factory and Andrew was products were being made in our factories, they were like, what are they doing? Right, so, so we like, you know, that was super early. And I’m like, you know, like, let’s see what their mate you know, what their product looks like, and their stitching and all that stuff.

Ian Sells 21:00
And, and they were early too. And so, you know, we joined an entrepreneurship group, like an accelerator here in San Diego, that was helping us. And it was made up of a bunch of CEOs that ran other consumer products, very traditional companies, and for the most part, you know, they understood Amazon, but they didn’t think of Amazon as, as the thing. So we had this company that was doing a ton of sales on Amazon.

Ian Sells 21:26
And they are like, you need a patent you need. You need a moat around your business, you need to get into retail because that’s where it’s at, right? And if you want to raise money, you know, we’ll help you put together a deck so, but you can’t raise money without a pad, you know. So we did all of these things for years. I look at it as robbing Peter to pay Paul, right. We’re like making money on Amazon. But we’re spending all of it to try to go to trade shows and get our sore chargers into Walmart and, you know, target and Cabala’s and

Yoni Mazor 21:56
Trying to do the reverse pyramid. You know, you’re born on eCommerce penetrated,

Ian Sells 21:59
Right? Because e-commerce was so eCommerce was so early that back then, all of the people who are giving you advice, didn’t understand it. And we didn’t either. And we were chasing the shiny object, which is like you’re big

Yoni Mazor 22:12
Box to kind of market but the real industry of retail would say yeah, you’re like fill in the masses of people in the brick and mortar. So that is where you have a real business, right? Yeah, yeah. Fast forward a few years later, different ballgame. We’ll get there. But yeah,

Ian Sells 22:25
Yeah. So you know, we went to trade shows we would you got into to Walmart, we got checks from Walmart, you know, and the idea was like, oh, Walmart’s, you make an order Costas, you make an order, you’re going to make a million dollars, you know, and we had, we had done a million plus and sales on Amazon. And in the early days, within a year or two of the business.

Ian Sells 22:41
So we were already doing well, we were making money. But we were, we were trying to build a premium brand. When we had we had this thing called a black box mentality. We just bypass and put it in a black box. And that was it, right? And we thought we’d sell it for less, we were the low-cost leader. So anchor can be expensive, but we tell the same thing because Andrew was buying off-the-shelf products as well, they weren’t developing things in the early days, right, they were selling the same things we were at a higher price or trying to but they weren’t trying to get retails.

Ian Sells 23:10
So and retail you didn’t even a higher price because you need those, you know, those 50 60% margins for the retailer. So Amazon was not that way you want to have the cheapest price or to drive sales, right. So yeah, we spent a lot of effort and time and money on doing that versus chasing Amazon. And so you know, looking back like well we could have been anchored you know if we had just focused on Amazon and just launched more products and did that you know,

Yoni Mazor 23:34
I mean, I’ve been to China I’ve seen anchor around the store is this you know, so we’re another day eventually got to where they need to be, but I guess they credit their mirth firstly, I guess an E-commerce or instead of that land for a good amount of time until they I guess maybe maximize your growth right and say, Okay, where can we go next? Right, you realize your full potential when you’re saying you guys thought you reach your full potential and that’s why you got to go to brick and mortar what? Maybe effectively you had the potential to go 10x on generics and those elements like anchor did

Ian Sells 24:01
ya interview Oh, no anchor if you don’t know started by x Google guys. So they were already very connected, understood it, knew the market, and were focused on what they were doing. They saw it took a while to get their foothold, but they were early right in the early bird catches the worm and they were early in the electronic space are the same products. We you know, we had products that rank better for Bluetooth speakers and stuff like that. But we just didn’t take advantage of that market timing.

Ian Sells 24:25
So market timing, you know, for me in my life, my career has been, you know, a problem. Real Estate Market timing screwed me, you know, when I was making a big, you know, made millions of dollars out of our college and then lost a ton in th

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